think of them in scale degrees. the 'boxes' are not the actual numbers, its the space between the numbers. so when the first two notes of Am pent is
5---8 there is a minor third in between them, 3 half steps. move that to the key of Cm and you have 8---11, still a minor third. help?
0 Kudo
Solo Delving (HELP) (ADVICE)
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 erich |
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Posts: 1161 (05/20/2009 11:28 PM) Bust down the double doors... |
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 dparker |
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Posts: 214 (05/21/2009 12:26 AM) |
yup, i understand that say a certain shape "box" is just moved up say a whole step, so your root note has changed, but the shape "box" is
still the same thing, but if you do that, then the "5th box/at the end of the neck" would dissapear...that's where i was confused, because I want
to be able to start a lick somewhere, and finish it at a different part of the neck for that different tone.
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ilikeminis |
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Posts: 40 (05/21/2009 2:47 AM) |
you understand that the "boxes" can be moved. that's good. here's how i remember learning all that. so, let's say you start by
learning all the boxes up and down the neck for, Am pentatonic (which is C major btw, but we don't need to rush that far yet). So I would always take that
shape, which is anchored on the A note on the sixth string. So then i want to play in Bm instead. I would just slide that exact same "box" up two
frets to where that shape anchors at the B note on the sixth string. I think you understand this.
So that's good. now as to your confusion about boxes disappeaing when you change keys, that's just the way it is. Think about this instead, at the twelth fret, essentially you are starting over. The 13th fret is the same note as the 1st fret on any given string. So if you're in Am pentatonic, you have the 4th shape (hopefully you see which one i'm talking about) anchored at the 12th fret, and it's also anchored at the 0 fret (both being the E note). If you went to Gm, the 4th shape anchored at the 12th fret would slide up to the 10th fret, and the 4th shape anchored at the 0 fret would slide up to the -2 fret (which doesn't exist). Pictures help with this, sorry i dont have any. As far as learning 35 boxes, you don't have to. If you learn the shapes of the 5 boxes for Am, you know the five boxes for any other key. For example, remember that 4th shape i was talking about? In Am pentatonic, it's anchored at the 12th fret. But in Em, that exact same shape is anchored at the 7th fret. It just takes some practice to get used to how the shapes slide up and down the neck. Just remember, the boxes are always in the same order. (I'm gonna go way over your head here, but i think it will give you something to look forward to) What i've been working on a lot lately, is how different scales overlap. Example: Say i want to play Gravity (its in G methinks). It sounds awesome with the G major scale (which has all the notes of the Em pentatonic scale, as well as all the notes of the Bm pentatonic, and the Am pentatonic). So what i've been experimenting with is even though Gravity is in G, you can play any of those scales over it, and the notes all fit into the key. But by focusing on the different pentatonic scales (remember the exact same notes are in G major scale), you can give the song a different feel. Em would have the feel you get when you listen to JM play it. Bm would be somewhat darker but still in the same vein, and Am is gonna be entirely different altogether (i might have those backwards, i dont have a guitar in front of me, and i'm still learning this concept too). Anyway, i know i kinda tend to ramble, but hopefully you got something out of that. When in doubt, find a friend who knows this stuff backwards, forwards, and upsidedown, and as him/her. it's always much much much easier to explain and demonstrate in person and with an actual guitar.
I am in repair. I'm not together but I'm getting there.
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dparker |
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Posts: 214 (05/21/2009 10:23 AM) |
k thx
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jmsdiabrrocks |
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Posts: 1350 (05/21/2009 2:02 PM) Midnight...lock all the doors. |
OK Dparker,
I will give you a bit of info for scales. I will try to be as clear as possible but if anything doesnt make sense, just ask. What the person above was saying about how Am pent and Bm pent also fit into the G major scale is true, BUT I don't think it's a great way to remember other shapes. Instead of Am pent in G major, I'd learn the A dorian and instead of B minor pent, you can learn Em OK so go to this link: http://www.rodgoelz.com/caged_scales.htm I will be referencing the above link. You can learn these scales just like how it shows and that's called the CAGED method based off of shapes chords from CAGED. (all major). But I will show you what I show my students to learn for beginning scale positions. The first, is the the major scale starting on the low E string. In the link its the fourth picture from the left. Lets start with G major, so again, fourth picture shape, Start playing a G with your second finger (middle finger) where the "2" is, or where the shape starts. Walk all the way up, two octaves to the high G. That's the first G major Ionian Scale. Then, to learn what is called A Dorian, (note that A dorian has ALL of the exact same notes as G major Ionian, just in a different starting and ending point, the 2nd degree instead of the first) Sorry I have to send you links, but heres the second link http://www.cyberfret.com/scales/reference/dorian.php This scale should be started on the 5th fret on A and it's A dorian, again the same notes as G major just in a different order. The third pattern: Em (E Aeolian) Again, same notes at G major just starting on the 6th degree. To achieve these notes, refer back to the first link, first picture. I want you to ignore the notes on the low E string for now, and start on the A string (7th fret, 1st finger). You then walk up again two octaves and if you want you can slide up to the 12th fret high E string to E. It's not in the picture. That same picture also shows you G major, on the 10th fret, starting on the A string. This is also good to note and remember that the natural minor of G (Em) starts just three frets down from that G. It's the same pattern just starting in a different location. now for the last pattern, your E minor scale. It starts on the 12th fret on the low E string. The scale is on the first link again, third picture. Start were the number one is, on the 12th fret and walk all the way up to the 15th fret on the high E string which is G. This will get you started, if you think it will help, save the links and copy what I posted and take one scale at a time. Go really slow, seriously. If you don't have a lot of time to practice just do the first three strings of a scale for a week. Do it while you're watching tv just practice and practice. Let me know if this made you confused tens times more or if it actually helped. Good luck!
Brandon
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al77 |
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Posts: 229 (05/21/2009 3:33 PM) |
JMMSM wrote:ahahhaha that's what i wanted to say after i read his post.. |
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fredromaniszen |
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Posts: 2556 (05/21/2009 4:37 PM) |
dparker, you should get a teacher, seriously.
I'm brazilian, if you'd like to know. Sorry for any english mistakes!
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bdam123 |
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Posts: 1085 (05/22/2009 3:31 AM) Could I ever Breakaway? |
dparker, hit me up with your questions on PM. I'm pretty good at explaining things like this. Hopefully I can shine a light.
Sorry I was too lazy to read all the post but its late and I was overwhelmed. The PM will isolate things for me. I don't know, don't ask. haha. Just hit me up. |
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handonam |
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Posts: 1994 (05/22/2009 5:30 AM) |
damn, i've forgotten how i learned guitar to get up to this point.
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donewithfashion |
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Posts: 954 (05/22/2009 6:00 AM) Always buzzin' just like neon... |
The way I learned to solo was a) by learning the minor pentatonic scale b) listening to other guitarists and trying to learn their licks, that way i learnt how
to phrase properly. I wouldnt worry about learning loads of scales or trying to play all over the neck right away. Just stick with the box minor pentatonic, go
put some SRV or JM on try and see if you can copy some of the licks. Once you get comfortable with that you'll start building your soloing vocab and
you'll be able to create stuff for yourself, then slowly you can begin adding new scales and trying to play all over the neck. You gotta crawl before you
can walk.
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